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Flat spots on both tires (new!)
#1
Hey,

I bought a cycle nearly a month ago. The back wheel went out of true in 2 days. Took it back to the shop I bought it from and got it trued..
Then I realised that at one point on the rim, the tire went in closer to the rim. This resulted in a bumpy ride..I took it back to them yesterday..and then tried refitting the tire onto the rim. The strange thing is, when they refit the tyre, another part of the tire went in closer to the rim and the earlier part was at normal level. So this isnt a tire problem..?
They went ahead and put a new tire on the front wheel..even this one goes in but not as much..and the back tire still has a flat spot..
I checked the inner part of the rim for any protruding spokes, etc but its fine (even trued for roundness).

Is this a tire or a tube problem? What can I do about it myself?
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#2
(02-27-2010, 08:01 AM)reddox Wrote:  Hey,

I bought a cycle nearly a month ago. The back wheel went out of true in 2 days. Took it back to the shop I bought it from and got it trued..
Then I realised that at one point on the rim, the tire went in closer to the rim. This resulted in a bumpy ride..I took it back to them yesterday..and then tried refitting the tire onto the rim. The strange thing is, when they refit the tyre, another part of the tire went in closer to the rim and the earlier part was at normal level. So this isnt a tire problem..?
They went ahead and put a new tire on the front wheel..even this one goes in but not as much..and the back tire still has a flat spot..
I checked the inner part of the rim for any protruding spokes, etc but its fine (even trued for roundness).

Is this a tire or a tube problem? What can I do about it myself..?? Help!!

Good morning (atleast here),
I'm not saying this is the problem but here is something for you to read that may give a little light on the problem. Do wait to hear a couple of the other guys or gals here that have much experience from building there own wheels.
Good maintenance to your Bike, can make it like the wheels are, true and smooth!
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#3
@Bill: Thanks for your reply! Did you mean to attach a link? Or were you talking about your signature??

If I inflate the front wheel even more, the ride is bumpy.
Here are my tire specs:
Front (the replaced one): 1.75x26 (text on tire recommends inflation to 45 psi)
Rear (came with the bike): 1.95x26 (40 - 60psi)

Mine is a mountain bike with gears, dual suspension and an aluminum body.
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#4
Lol man I am sooo sorry very early here...

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tooltips/truing.html
Good maintenance to your Bike, can make it like the wheels are, true and smooth!
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#5
(02-27-2010, 02:10 PM)Bill Wrote:  Lol man I am sooo sorry very early here...

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tooltips/truing.html

Good info on wheel truing thanks.
My dad always told me a Sledge a matic can fix any thing.
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#6
Nothing is wrong with the tires if the replacement does the same thing (Unless its the same kind of tire, and you just happen to get a bad run from the manufacturer). Try a different kind of tire, and see if the problem persists. If it does, see part 2.

Part 2: There is a problem with the rim. How did you determine the wheel wasn't out of round? When truing a wheel, adjustments made on one side of the wheel, affect the roundness of the wheel if not compensated for. Bring the wheel to another shop and have them check for true, laterally and longitudinally. The guy at the shop you've been going to might not have the best idea of what he's doing.
Dedicated scholar of bicycles
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#7
(02-28-2010, 01:36 AM)jr14 Wrote:  Nothing is wrong with the tires if the replacement does the same thing (Unless its the same kind of tire, and you just happen to get a bad run from the manufacturer). Try a different kind of tire, and see if the problem persists. If it does, see part 2.

Part 2: There is a problem with the rim. How did you determine the wheel wasn't out of round? When truing a wheel, adjustments made on one side of the wheel, affect the roundness of the wheel if not compensated for. Bring the wheel to another shop and have them check for true, laterally and longitudinally. The guy at the shop you've been going to might not have the best idea of what he's doing.

They replaced the front with a different kind of tire (its thinner at 1.75 and of a different make).
I got the wheels trued for roundness too at a different shop. On the truing stand, everything looked (and felt) fine.
I have access to only an old hand pump... so even after 15 minutes of pumping, the rear tire wasn't overinflated (Sheldon Brown recommends this technique to properly seat a flat spot)... the nearest shop is around 15KM.
(02-27-2010, 02:10 PM)Bill Wrote:  Lol man I am sooo sorry very early here...

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tooltips/truing.html

Wink
Read that already. But my rims are in true..so this page that talks about seating the tire properly is relevant:
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/flats.html
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#8
It's probably not a wheel problem, but a problem with the tire not seating properly. Spin the wheel slowly and see if it looks like the sidewall of the tire goes farther in to the rim at one point. If so, one fix is to deflate the tire, put a little soapy water along the bead where the tire sits against the inside of the rim, and then reinflate. You may need to go beyond the "max" pressure, but if you do it carefully, you'll probably get the tire to pop into place correctly and then you can return the pressure to normal. When doing this, just be careful that there aren't any spots where the tire is farther out than normal. It could then slip off and pop the tube.

Having a tire sit uneven like this isn't uncommon on new lower end tires (sometime higher end too.) Once the tires been seated properly for a while they usually behave better after that.
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#9
Thing is, the rear tyre's sidewall goes farther in at some points but not farther out. On the other hand, the front tyre - the one I got replaced for 'free'..cheaper one apparently..- it goes farther in and out at different points...and when I spin the wheel, from the top it looks like its bulging from the sides at some points...

The mechanic I went to today (he was renovating so didn't fix anything) said something about the front tyre (the replacement one) not being nylon. Is this a bad thing??

And I'm not able to pump beyond a certain pressure with my hand pump...have no way to measure pressure either..will try this out when I go to the mechanic in a day or two.
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#10
I'm not sure what a tire is made of if it's not nylon. But it sounds like some cheapo tires.

Where the tire goes in too far it will make that annoying bump when you ride. But where the tire comes out too far is a bigger issue. If it is actually slipping up out of the rim, it will probably blow out the tube when you ride. There is usually a thin line on the edge of the tire that should sit right above the top of the rim when the tire is mounted correctly. If that line is more than a couple millimeters above the rim, it might be slipping out.

Doesn't sound like the shop that sold you the bike is really trying that hard to fix the problem. But if they're working on it for free (they should be) probably worth letting them try again. But I think you need to get a better pump if you can't get above 40 psi with it.
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#11
The front tyre's witness line (the thin line) is right above the rim in places where it isn't busy hiding in the rim. Nothing too far. But the problem is that at the flat spot where the witness line's inside the rim, one side/edge of the tyre's fine (can see the witness line). The other side's below the rim. This is causing a bulging effect that looks bad when I spin the wheel.
Went around 12 Km on a dirt road today. No issues at all..what can happen with a flat spot..?
Nah, I don't think I'll go that shop again. I'll just pay a good mechanic to do it.
I'm sure I get at least 40psi. It just doesn't seem to go in after a point. But yes, point taken.
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#12
Okay, I went to the mechanic today...tried the soapy water thing... filled both the tires till they were hard as a rock. Both still have flat spots (the front one has many and the rear, just one flat spot).
The pressure measuring device wasn't compatible with my valve so couldn't really get the reading.

He tried putting in a new tire but it had flat spots too. The mechanic said something about needing very good quality tires because my rim's alloy and stuff... does the build of the RIM really make a difference in tire seating?
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#13
Even though there shouldn't be, there is some variation in the actual diameter of where the bead seat on different rims are. Even though they're all within a compatible range, some wheels are actually bigger than others. This is why some wheels are harder to mount tires to than others. On top of that, tires have the same variation so some fit tighter than others. Cheaper tires tend to also be somewhat inconsistent and not perfectly round. So you typically have this problem more with cheaper tires. But since you've tried different tires, the only thing I can think of is that this bike has particularly tight/large rims and that makes it harder for the tire to sit where it's supposed to. It keeps trying to slip in farther.

A solution is trickier. There is a special pair of pliers made for dealing with this. It has wide crescent shaped jaws so you can grab the tire and actually pull it out into the bead seat. You could try with some regular pliers, just try not to gouge the tire up. The good news is that once you get a tire to seat right, they seem to stretch into place a little and usually mount fine after that. Otherwise, you might have to go into a shop and have then just try a number of tires to see if they can get one to fit better.
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#14
I think this is the tool Dave is referring to....
http://www.amazon.com/Park-Tool-PTS-1-Tire-Seating/dp/B000OZBJVU/
Good maintenance to your Bike, can make it like the wheels are, true and smooth!
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#15
(03-04-2010, 03:07 AM)Bill Wrote:  I think this is the tool Dave is referring to....
http://www.amazon.com/Park-Tool-PTS-1-Tire-Seating/dp/B000OZBJVU/

Kewl, thanks Bill. I think I might weld a couple pieces of cut pipe to an old water pump wrench to make my own. Smile

Steve
Junkyard Tools rescued from the junkyard!
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#16
(03-05-2010, 06:01 PM)KC-Steve Wrote:  
(03-04-2010, 03:07 AM)Bill Wrote:  I think this is the tool Dave is referring to....
http://www.amazon.com/Park-Tool-PTS-1-Tire-Seating/dp/B000OZBJVU/

Kewl, thanks Bill. I think I might weld a couple pieces of cut pipe to an old water pump wrench to make my own. Smile

Steve

Please make a thread with details in tools when you finish, I am very interested Steve. Smile
Good maintenance to your Bike, can make it like the wheels are, true and smooth!
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#17
(03-05-2010, 07:25 PM)Bill Wrote:  Please make a thread with details in tools when you finish, I am very interested Steve. Smile

I posted it here. Nuthin to it. Big Grin

http://forums.bicycletutor.com/thread-1115.html

Steve
Junkyard Tools rescued from the junkyard!
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#18
can anyone post some pics of how to use the tool to seat a tyre properly?
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#19
(11-21-2013, 04:23 AM)Adrian44 Wrote:  can anyone post some pics of how to use the tool to seat a tyre properly?
Welcome to bicycleTutor Adrian, Need a little more info about what your problem is. do you mean you cannot seem to get the tire to bead right and when you spin the tire it looks loped?
Park tool PTS-1 can help, but is an expensive set of customized chanel lock pliars for sure. brute force and working the tire while under inflated works also. this all assuming you have the correct tire size and iso for your rim
There are two kinds of people in the world, "Those who help themselves to people, and those who help people!"
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#20
(02-27-2010, 08:01 AM)reddox Wrote:  Hey,

I bought a cycle nearly a month ago. The back wheel went out of true in 2 days. Took it back to the shop I bought it from and got it trued..
Then I realised that at one point on the rim, the tire went in closer to the rim. This resulted in a bumpy ride..I took it back to them yesterday..and then tried refitting the tire onto the rim. The strange thing is, when they refit the tyre, another part of the tire went in closer to the rim and the earlier part was at normal level. So this isnt a tire problem..?
They went ahead and put a new tire on the front wheel..even this one goes in but not as much..and the back tire still has a flat spot..
I checked the inner part of the rim for any protruding spokes, etc but its fine (even trued for roundness).

Is this a tire or a tube problem? What can I do about it myself?

I have had the same problem and did everything you did. But a bike shop owner told of a trick that works to correct the problem most of the time. Get a spray bottle and put a 50/50 mix of water and liquid laundry soap in it. shake it up . deflate the tires on the rims and spry the beads all the way around sopping wet on both sides. slow inflate the tire with a hand pump checking the bead ever now and then until they are pressured up. I found this works very well with any tire that does not want to seat correctly. see if it works
BLBaszis
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